waiguoren the dianying 3
Tigerman -
1. We admitted we were powerless over alcohol--that our lives had become unmanageable.
2. Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
3. Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him.
4. Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
5. Admitted to God, to ourselves and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
6. Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.
7. Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings.
8. Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all.
9. Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.
10. Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it.
11. Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God, as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His will for us and the power to carry that out.
12. Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.
bob -
The Twelve suggested steps of Bignose Anonymous
1) We admitted that we were powerless over being an arrogant bignose - that our lives had become umanageble.
2) Came to believe that a power higher than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
3) Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the genius and wisdom of Chinese culture as we understood it.
4) Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
5) Admitted to the great Chinese people, ourselves and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
6) Were entirely willing to let the great Chinese people remove all of these defects of character.
7) Humbly asked them to remove all of our shortcomings.
8) Made a list of all of the people we had harmed and became willing to make amends to them all.
9) Made direct amends to them except when to do so would injure them or others.
10) Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admited it.
11) Sought through meditation and discourse to improve our contact with the great Chinese people, as we understand them, hoping only for knowledge of their will and the power to carry that out.
12) Having had a spiritual awakening as a result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to other arrogant bignoses everywhere, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.
Screaming Jesus - Instead of going step-by-step, maybe you could just have different foreigners sitting in a circle giving their testimony. This way different actors could all have their moment in the sun, and vary the monotony that way.
If you're feeling ambitious, you could even splice in footage taken outside the room--say, foreigner sitting on motorcycle with wife and five kids, no helmet, or manning the betel-but booth.
There should be a newcomer to the group, who is introduced to the concept and to all the other foreigners. Of course he should "fall off the wagon" at some point, prompting an intervention. (Or should he try to get everybody else to fall of the wagon with him, in order to get them off his back?)
If you do this, just be sure to give the glory to Jesus.
bob - Yes I think a discussion would be better than a series of presentations too.
Right now I am thinking that an interesting film could be made if the basic idea was that we were going to mirror the stages of culture shock: infatuation, rejection, acceptance; without ever actually saying the words culture shock. The rejection segment would give us all a good opportunity to air our grievances. Perhaps it could end with most people agreeing that both sides had something to learn from each other.
Black and white interiors/ color exteriors then?
Of course you get credit.
Do you speak Chinese at all? Perhaps you could be one of the actors in our little production.
Screaming Jesus - Moderately okay. Is there going to be a script, or would I be expected to write my own lines?
Omniloquacious - If you can get a hot leading xiaojie, I'll volunteer for the bedroom scenes, in which I'll slobber and grunt in perfect foreigner Mandarin. I'll even let the makeup people glue some hair to my shoulders and arse for heightened dramatic effect.
bob - Jesus - I was hoping that we could hash out a general idea and attempt to translate it here, and then get together one night and make a party out of improvising from that basic idea. The real challenge for most of us will be bringing our Chinese up to snuff. So, I guess that's a yes. You gotta write your own and translate it to Chinese. I think if we can get four or five waigourens and four five sponsors we will be doing well.
Omni - I was wondering when you would finally chip in.
wolf_reinhold - I wish to play role of the corpse. Either dead or re-animated.
bob - An interesting thing to consider about "Waiguoren the Dianying" as it is so far concieved is that at the outset many Taiwanese might not get that we are kidding. Likewise many foriegners might not get that we are not entirely kidding. It occured to me that at the beginning of the film we ought to comport ourselves extremely badly so as to add to the effect. As the evening progresses we could become more and more composed but at the same time more cognizant of this cultures failings.
In terms of decor, I say shoot it in one room but slowly change the lighting and the decor to reflect the changing attitude of the characters.
Isn't there some computer software that could help us with the translations?
Screaming Jesus - It should start by displaying some quote or other, by some local politician or other, to the effect that foreigners are a "problem." (Our kids don't speak Chinese well enough and are confused about their identity, etc.)
The central conceit of the movie could be that sometime awhile back, some of us started actually believing this ourselves, and founded a 12-step group. Maybe there could be (hovering in the background) a portrait of the founder (the "Bill W. analogue) who would be a white guy wearing a Mandarin collar and skullcap, Confucius clothes, something like that.
So now the challenge becomes, what funny things can we do to show how much we've assimilated? (Or failed to assimilate?) For instance, the ladies could giggle with their hands over their mouths, fan themselves with paper fans, etc.
Maybe the "newbie" could try to derail everybody by bringing McDonalds food to the meeting, only to see the others slice up the Big Mac, put everything in the middle of the table, and eat little bites using chopsticks.
I have an idea which would be a bit more trouble, but still feasible, I think. Go around to places where there are large groups of different types of foreigners (the mosque? a construction site? some buxiban?) and get each group to sing one or two lines of a song which one of us would have to compose. (I'm thinking of something like that Taiwanese TV beer commercial.) Then splice them together, and we've got a catchy...something.
Heh, maybe this could be one of those public-service messages they play before the movies, like "wear condoms" and "don't beat your wife."
Another "opening credit" idea would be...well, I keep picturing my six-year-old little friend squeezing a fifty-year-old friend's big bulbous nose, in a spirit of awe and wonder.
Xpet - bob wrote: Isn't there some computer software that could help us with the translations?
Bob, I see you are really getting into this. I'd suggest you guys use babelfish at http://babelfish.altavista.com/ for quick, crude and guaranteed comical English > Chinese translations, no worries about anybody not noticing you're kidding anymore (on second thought, this, after all, is Taiwan ...!). Now, do you need my lamp or what?
bob - Jesus I think I should fess up here and admit that I don't actually have any idea really how to make a movie. I mean I have certainly "seen" a lot of movies, and I read about them and use them as a basis for ESL classes but that is about it.
I was reading something by a director recently and he said that it is just like telling a story in pictures.....For ex. I knew these guys once living in Taipe (shot of guys in identifiable Taipei location) who started believing the things that the locals said about them (shot of locals saying that foriegners only want to sleep with a lot of girls, can't be trusted, speak lousy Chinese, are selfish etc.) (shot of disconcerted foriegners face). They decided to form BA (shot of the BA manifesto rolling out of the printer).....etc. You continue in this way and in the process introduce some characters who need to work together to achieve some goal or overcome some conflict. That motivation drives the action and the action drives the dialogue. Hopefully something is learned by somebody in all of this and it is all presented in an entertaining manner.
That is one way.
The other way is to put some interesting personalities together in a room and film what actually happens between them. This is what I have done before. For example I spent an afternoon smoking pot at an old muscicians house filming the process of him getting his groove back. Later I edited it and threw in some other odd bits. The advantage of this method is that nobody needs to remember lines or act. They just act like themselves. Imagine the sort of wierdness and hilarity that might ensue if we set a bunch of us to work on practicing the kind of manadarin that would be required to have the sort of discussion that would transpire at a BA meeting. This basic footage could then be edited and perhaps some scenes even staged such as you are suggesting. I should tell you though that while I do not know much about film making I do know that everything is about a thousand times more difficult than you expect.
In any case I am certainly happy to have bent the ear of people like you and Xpet. Who knows we may even make something happen here.
Xpet - I suspect that we may need you a lot more than your lamp. Thanks.
Screaming Jesus - You got a decent camera? Then you're set. I mean, go watch "Star Trek: Nemesis" or "Hardball"--you couldn't do any worse than that!
Another possible approach would be to make this a faux recruiting video for the 12-step group. Where we tell the story of the founder, the group, and give our personal testimonies, etc..
bob - Perfect - That would allow us to contrast the interpersonal styles of those who have been through the BA process and those who have not. I guess it would make sense to cast those with better Chinese as BA graduates.
For production purposes maybe we can think of this whole thing as a theme "party" (and all that entails), and then edit it together in some meaningful way later.
I have a pretty old Hi-8 with a broken battery pack. It takes good pictures and captures sound really well but if we want to run it through editing software we need digital software I think. With mine we could edit it on to VHS and then copy that on to VCD but I don't imagine all of those transfers would do much for the picture quality.
We need to get some of the folks from arts and entertainment working on this thing.
1. We admitted we were powerless over alcohol--that our lives had become unmanageable.
2. Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
3. Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him.
4. Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
5. Admitted to God, to ourselves and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
6. Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.
7. Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings.
8. Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all.
9. Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.
10. Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it.
11. Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God, as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His will for us and the power to carry that out.
12. Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.
bob -
The Twelve suggested steps of Bignose Anonymous
1) We admitted that we were powerless over being an arrogant bignose - that our lives had become umanageble.
2) Came to believe that a power higher than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
3) Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the genius and wisdom of Chinese culture as we understood it.
4) Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
5) Admitted to the great Chinese people, ourselves and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
6) Were entirely willing to let the great Chinese people remove all of these defects of character.
7) Humbly asked them to remove all of our shortcomings.
8) Made a list of all of the people we had harmed and became willing to make amends to them all.
9) Made direct amends to them except when to do so would injure them or others.
10) Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admited it.
11) Sought through meditation and discourse to improve our contact with the great Chinese people, as we understand them, hoping only for knowledge of their will and the power to carry that out.
12) Having had a spiritual awakening as a result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to other arrogant bignoses everywhere, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.
Screaming Jesus - Instead of going step-by-step, maybe you could just have different foreigners sitting in a circle giving their testimony. This way different actors could all have their moment in the sun, and vary the monotony that way.
If you're feeling ambitious, you could even splice in footage taken outside the room--say, foreigner sitting on motorcycle with wife and five kids, no helmet, or manning the betel-but booth.
There should be a newcomer to the group, who is introduced to the concept and to all the other foreigners. Of course he should "fall off the wagon" at some point, prompting an intervention. (Or should he try to get everybody else to fall of the wagon with him, in order to get them off his back?)
If you do this, just be sure to give the glory to Jesus.
bob - Yes I think a discussion would be better than a series of presentations too.
Right now I am thinking that an interesting film could be made if the basic idea was that we were going to mirror the stages of culture shock: infatuation, rejection, acceptance; without ever actually saying the words culture shock. The rejection segment would give us all a good opportunity to air our grievances. Perhaps it could end with most people agreeing that both sides had something to learn from each other.
Black and white interiors/ color exteriors then?
Of course you get credit.
Do you speak Chinese at all? Perhaps you could be one of the actors in our little production.
Screaming Jesus - Moderately okay. Is there going to be a script, or would I be expected to write my own lines?
Omniloquacious - If you can get a hot leading xiaojie, I'll volunteer for the bedroom scenes, in which I'll slobber and grunt in perfect foreigner Mandarin. I'll even let the makeup people glue some hair to my shoulders and arse for heightened dramatic effect.
bob - Jesus - I was hoping that we could hash out a general idea and attempt to translate it here, and then get together one night and make a party out of improvising from that basic idea. The real challenge for most of us will be bringing our Chinese up to snuff. So, I guess that's a yes. You gotta write your own and translate it to Chinese. I think if we can get four or five waigourens and four five sponsors we will be doing well.
Omni - I was wondering when you would finally chip in.
wolf_reinhold - I wish to play role of the corpse. Either dead or re-animated.
bob - An interesting thing to consider about "Waiguoren the Dianying" as it is so far concieved is that at the outset many Taiwanese might not get that we are kidding. Likewise many foriegners might not get that we are not entirely kidding. It occured to me that at the beginning of the film we ought to comport ourselves extremely badly so as to add to the effect. As the evening progresses we could become more and more composed but at the same time more cognizant of this cultures failings.
In terms of decor, I say shoot it in one room but slowly change the lighting and the decor to reflect the changing attitude of the characters.
Isn't there some computer software that could help us with the translations?
Screaming Jesus - It should start by displaying some quote or other, by some local politician or other, to the effect that foreigners are a "problem." (Our kids don't speak Chinese well enough and are confused about their identity, etc.)
The central conceit of the movie could be that sometime awhile back, some of us started actually believing this ourselves, and founded a 12-step group. Maybe there could be (hovering in the background) a portrait of the founder (the "Bill W. analogue) who would be a white guy wearing a Mandarin collar and skullcap, Confucius clothes, something like that.
So now the challenge becomes, what funny things can we do to show how much we've assimilated? (Or failed to assimilate?) For instance, the ladies could giggle with their hands over their mouths, fan themselves with paper fans, etc.
Maybe the "newbie" could try to derail everybody by bringing McDonalds food to the meeting, only to see the others slice up the Big Mac, put everything in the middle of the table, and eat little bites using chopsticks.
I have an idea which would be a bit more trouble, but still feasible, I think. Go around to places where there are large groups of different types of foreigners (the mosque? a construction site? some buxiban?) and get each group to sing one or two lines of a song which one of us would have to compose. (I'm thinking of something like that Taiwanese TV beer commercial.) Then splice them together, and we've got a catchy...something.
Heh, maybe this could be one of those public-service messages they play before the movies, like "wear condoms" and "don't beat your wife."
Another "opening credit" idea would be...well, I keep picturing my six-year-old little friend squeezing a fifty-year-old friend's big bulbous nose, in a spirit of awe and wonder.
Xpet - bob wrote: Isn't there some computer software that could help us with the translations?
Bob, I see you are really getting into this. I'd suggest you guys use babelfish at http://babelfish.altavista.com/ for quick, crude and guaranteed comical English > Chinese translations, no worries about anybody not noticing you're kidding anymore (on second thought, this, after all, is Taiwan ...!). Now, do you need my lamp or what?
bob - Jesus I think I should fess up here and admit that I don't actually have any idea really how to make a movie. I mean I have certainly "seen" a lot of movies, and I read about them and use them as a basis for ESL classes but that is about it.
I was reading something by a director recently and he said that it is just like telling a story in pictures.....For ex. I knew these guys once living in Taipe (shot of guys in identifiable Taipei location) who started believing the things that the locals said about them (shot of locals saying that foriegners only want to sleep with a lot of girls, can't be trusted, speak lousy Chinese, are selfish etc.) (shot of disconcerted foriegners face). They decided to form BA (shot of the BA manifesto rolling out of the printer).....etc. You continue in this way and in the process introduce some characters who need to work together to achieve some goal or overcome some conflict. That motivation drives the action and the action drives the dialogue. Hopefully something is learned by somebody in all of this and it is all presented in an entertaining manner.
That is one way.
The other way is to put some interesting personalities together in a room and film what actually happens between them. This is what I have done before. For example I spent an afternoon smoking pot at an old muscicians house filming the process of him getting his groove back. Later I edited it and threw in some other odd bits. The advantage of this method is that nobody needs to remember lines or act. They just act like themselves. Imagine the sort of wierdness and hilarity that might ensue if we set a bunch of us to work on practicing the kind of manadarin that would be required to have the sort of discussion that would transpire at a BA meeting. This basic footage could then be edited and perhaps some scenes even staged such as you are suggesting. I should tell you though that while I do not know much about film making I do know that everything is about a thousand times more difficult than you expect.
In any case I am certainly happy to have bent the ear of people like you and Xpet. Who knows we may even make something happen here.
Xpet - I suspect that we may need you a lot more than your lamp. Thanks.
Screaming Jesus - You got a decent camera? Then you're set. I mean, go watch "Star Trek: Nemesis" or "Hardball"--you couldn't do any worse than that!
Another possible approach would be to make this a faux recruiting video for the 12-step group. Where we tell the story of the founder, the group, and give our personal testimonies, etc..
bob - Perfect - That would allow us to contrast the interpersonal styles of those who have been through the BA process and those who have not. I guess it would make sense to cast those with better Chinese as BA graduates.
For production purposes maybe we can think of this whole thing as a theme "party" (and all that entails), and then edit it together in some meaningful way later.
I have a pretty old Hi-8 with a broken battery pack. It takes good pictures and captures sound really well but if we want to run it through editing software we need digital software I think. With mine we could edit it on to VHS and then copy that on to VCD but I don't imagine all of those transfers would do much for the picture quality.
We need to get some of the folks from arts and entertainment working on this thing.
posted by david at 1:19 AM
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